We continue with the second part of the interview conducted by our colleague Sergio Levinsky with Barcelona’s physical trainer, Julio Tous, who talks about his many previous experiences in Italy with Sampdoria, Inter, Juventus, and the national team.

I wanted to ask you about Real Madrid and injuries. There has been a lot of talk about the Pintus method in terms of energy. What happened to leave the defense out of the picture?

The issue of injuries, for those of us who have spent a lot of time studying it, trying to understand to what extent they can be prevented or not, is one of the most complex topics there is. And complex not because it is complicated, but because when you think you understand it, you realize you don’t understand anything. 

You have had a long career with many clubs, including the Italian national team. How does it feel to see Sampdoria in Serie C (the interview was conducted before Brescia’s administrative relegation gave Sampdoria the chance to play the relegation play-off against Salernitana)?

It was very hard because I think everyone leaves their heart in all the places they have worked, even if things went badly. The other day I was reading the article and I was in tears because I was thinking about that wonderful environment, Bogliasco and the whole beautiful area of Liguria towards the Cinque Terre and all that. And I said, “My God, I mean, I can’t believe Sampdoria has fallen so low.”

And then, of course, I was friends with the fitness coach, Paolo Bertelli, who was with Pirlo at the beginning of the season. The truth is that it was a tragedy with Sampdoria. It was a tragedy because it had always been a great club for me and they treated me fantastically. And actually, I have to say, it was the beginning of everything that followed, because there was the director Marotta, who then moved to Juventus, and they brought me to Juventus and finally to Inter. So it was a curious thing. They acquired a working model that we had started at Sampdoria. We passed it on to Juve right from the start.

Then I went to the national team with Conte. They developed it there, and then Marotta moved from Juve to Inter, and now he’s developing it at Inter. And it’s strange that it’s a repeated success, isn’t it? Because at the time, Sampdoria brought it to Europe with excellent results. Then at Juve, it had its golden period of nine consecutive league titles. And now Inter, well, I probably think it’s the benchmark team in Italy in recent years.

“My first year at Juve was the one where I felt the most pressure.”

You were with Conte at Juve, as well as with the Italian national team: what was it like working with him?

The first assignments weren’t full-time, they focused mainly on pre-season to get the work started, and then I would step in periodically. These interventions yielded good results, but it wasn’t the same as being there every day to solve every problem that arose.

Then I arrived at Juventus, where I met Conte. We met after following different paths: he had coached Bari and Atalanta before returning to Juve at a time of enormous pressure, after two consecutive seasons finishing in seventh place. Juventus had just returned to Serie A, and I remember that first year as the most stressful period of my career.

The pressure to get results was very high, especially for Conte, who was a Juventus fan and had been given his big chance. We had to manage the situation carefully, but then something extraordinary happened: we finished the season unbeaten, a feat never before achieved in Italy, with 43 games without defeat, losing only the Coppa Italia final in Rome against Napoli. In those moments, all the difficulties seemed to vanish.

“I’ve never seen a celebration like the one for my first Scudetto in Turin.”

I can imagine the contrast between what must have been the pressure of the whole year and then the final celebration or the complete turnaround.

I’ve never seen such jubilation. What I experienced in Turin with my first Scudetto was something unique: I was completely shocked and overwhelmed. People took to the streets because, I think, it had been almost ten years since they had lifted a cup, after it was taken away because of Calciopoli. It was a liberation, a real catharsis. We too, of course, were freed from enormous pressure, because we were considered the underdogs. In the end, however, everything turned out for the best.

That victory was a turning point for Juventus: it was the spearhead for a real renewal of the team. At the time, there were many world champions, such as Luca Toni, Iaquinta, and Fabio Grosso, but they were not part of the coach’s plans. So the change began. In the second year, Pogba and Arturo Vidal arrived, joining the team at the end of the preseason and greatly strengthening the squad. The icing on the cake of those three years was the arrival of Tevez, who played alongside Llorente, author of an incredible season. If I’m not mistaken, Tevez scored 20 goals and Llorente 17 or 18. That season reached its peak with 102 points, a result probably never achieved again in Serie A.

And wasn’t there the same pressure as before? I mean, did you feel the change?

It was a little less intense. I mean, with Conte, there’s always pressure, but in reality, compared to the first year, it was post-traumatic stress. I remember that preseason in Bardonecchia, it was like we were under siege, surrounded by fans, with a lot of tension, and you could feel the atmosphere. It was real pressure. And that’s when I realized, I always say this, that after going through that experience, anything that happens to me will seem easy.

How does it feel to be in a locker room with Arturo Vidal, Carlos Tevez, and Conte?

They’re great characters, but that only happens in football. When you win, everything falls into place, it becomes like perfect asphalt, a coat of paint that puts everything in its place. So, in all three years that we triumphed, we were the dominant team, often by a clear margin. However, for some reason, we never managed to reach the level that was expected of us in Europe.

I remember the quarter-finals against Bayern, one of the most dominant teams I’ve ever seen: they swept everything aside and won practically every competition. We came up against them and couldn’t do anything. But there was a winning atmosphere that sustained us until the end. As I said, it was difficult but it was worth it. We had a really great team, very difficult to beat, and I think all the players understood that, regardless of the difficulties, the important thing was to win and keep going.

“The Premier League is experienced differently from other leagues.”

About your time at Chelsea, I remember Victor Moses speaking very highly of you for the great season you had.

It was a wonderful experience because Chelsea is also a very special club and the Premier League is experienced a little differently from other leagues I’ve worked in. Because those grounds in the city center are full of pubs, with people celebrating, games at 3 p.m., 4 p.m., I’m not saying everyone is drunk, but everyone is happy and then after the game they can celebrate, it’s like a liturgy that draws you in.

The atmosphere at Stamford Bridge was wonderful and that helped a lot. It was a very well-structured club, with an absolutely American model. In fact, the manager was a New York lawyer with terrible experience. His name was Bruce Buck, and it was a company, an NBA franchise rather than a soccer team. We were able to intervene from the beginning with these players who were coming from a very unusual situation.

They had won the league two seasons earlier and had won it well, with Mourinho, and the following season they finished tenth. They had sacked Mou, Hiddink had arrived and it had been a disaster. They had lost everything that was important to such a powerful club and were out of European competition. So we were able to focus on the league.

When you coach players of that level, with systematic management and no midweek fixtures, you can give them a day or two off and everything becomes easier. Of course, football is full of variables and you can come up against better opponents, but that was a great team, with the best Hazard, Diego Costa, and even Cesc Fabregas, who, despite having a great season and providing around 10 assists, was considered a reserve and only played a few games.

There was Kanté, the best player in the Premier League, Matic, David Luiz in defense, and Courtois in goal. A very high-level lineup. We won the league by a comfortable margin and reached the Cup final, which we lost on a penalty that I thought was unfair: without VAR, we didn’t win the double, but it was a fantastic year because we were able to work well, with players like Victor Moses who gave their all.

With adequate recovery times and well-managed workloads, when you have this quality, it’s normal to get similar results. With lower-level players, it would have been much more difficult, especially considering that it was Guardiola’s first season at City and Mourinho’s first at United. Basically, the championship was between the two of them, and we won it.

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Yes, yes, there was talk again of the Guardiola-Mourinho duel. But in England.

Exactly. Yes, that’s true. That year was fantastic, and the following year there were more problems because Diego Costa left, Matic left, two very important players for the first team. David Luiz didn’t have the same continuity and it didn’t go well. We won the FA Cup, which is very difficult, and we started the following season, but we were fired. We had a sabbatical year and then we went to Milan, to Inter.

Previously, you had experience with the Italian national team, which was in crisis after failing to qualify for two World Cups. Do you think it’s a matter of adapting to these changes in football or is there some other physical problem?

As always, it’s very difficult to talk about it because people forget that Italy was also European champion. It’s incredible, it’s another black swan that no one expected. Italy was European champion, and Chiellini and company brought home the glory.

Let’s go back to the quality of the squad. The Italian team of 2006, if you look at who was there, was a great team. I had the opportunity to work with several of those world champions, and they were all people I knew from that team. They were extraordinary people on a personal level and as players. I’m talking about Buffon, Del Piero, Pirlo, Barzagli, Grosso, Iaquinta, and Luca, yes, Luca Toni. I mean, I had them all at one point, and now I understand why these guys became world champions.

Rossi, who I had later in the national team, and others I can’t remember now. That national team was incredible. I remember the following years, especially the first year at Juve, when Italy lost 4-0 to Spain in the European Championship final, and they came back very upset because they saw that Spain was already out of reach, but that they had taken a step forward. But then they managed to beat Spain.

In fact, when we were there at the European Championship in France, we beat Spain, and that was a bittersweet feeling, but huge for me: I was working with that team and these were players I had brought with me for five years, the backbone of the national team. So, the fact that they didn’t have that continuity, I honestly attribute more to cycles, as was also the case with the Spanish national team.“

”Being part of the Azzurri is one of the best experiences of my life.”

Suddenly, the Spanish national team stopped winning and even lost in the first round. The same thing happened with France, a team with an incredible squad. Well, it happens because these are knockout tournaments and things that need to happen don’t happen, either because all the players approach the game in the right way or because they are unable to adapt to play against those teams. The same thing happens when you arrive at Coverciano, at the café, which is wonderful, it looks like something left over from the 1960s, and you see Italy’s medal collection, and you say, “Well, let’s cross our fingers!” because there are medals everywhere. Second, third, first, second, second, third, first. In other words, a whole history of success over the last 90 years, perhaps since ‘34, when they won for the first time.

So, it’s very special to be part of the Azzurri. I think it’s one of the best experiences of my life because, as I said on the last day, ‘Hey, you made me feel Italian’. I would even find it difficult to work for the Spanish national team.

Can you sing Fratelli d’Italia?

Yes, basically yes. Actually, they asked me, “How do you feel and so on?” I said: fine. Let’s see, I feel Italian right now because this is my team. So, it was such a seamless integration that I had no doubts. I mean, it was obviously strange to see Spain, the Spanish anthem and so on, but it was wonderful. The truth is that it was one of the best experiences I’ve ever had. And I think they’ll be back. Italians always come back.

“Conte is one of the greatest winners I’ve ever known.”

I’d also like to ask you about Conte. What is Conte like? If you had to highlight something in particular about Conte, what would you say?

Well, he has an unbridled passion, especially for soccer and for winning. In other words, he is one of the greatest winners I have ever known. And of course, with all that unbridled passion, without filters, well, it’s not easy to live with. But as always, when you win, everything is fine in the end. On the day you lose, it’s better to hide, isn’t it? But I think his career speaks for itself, and what he has achieved, especially in teams that no one gave a penny for, is truly remarkable. If someone asked me to describe him in one word, it would be ‘winner’. A winner who is about to win the Scudetto (the interview was conducted before he actually won the Italian championship with Napoli).

“Italy is the country where a Spaniard feels most at home.”

Focusing on yourself, how have you adapted to so many changes?

Italy has been very easy for me because I think we are not brothers, but cousins. So it’s very easy. When I started, smaller cities like Genoa or Turin weren’t so well connected. You couldn’t even get there by direct flight. You had to go via Frankfurt or Madrid and so on, and it was a bit of a hassle. Otherwise, you had to rent a car from Milan, Malpensa and so on. And that made it a bit complicated to be so close, because in reality with a direct flight it’s an hour and a bit, so it’s, it’s, it’s very quick. Culturally we’re very similar, I think it’s the country where a Spaniard, I would say even more than Portugal, can feel most at home.

Because first of all, they really like us, almost everyone understands Spanish, they’ve spent their vacations here, and they probably know us better than we know them. Because it’s not that common for Spaniards to vacation here. Obviously, they do, but not as many as Italians here. And the Italian community in Spain right now is huge, so there are these ties. So it was very easy for me. Perhaps the worst thing was the climate in Turin: once at the airport, the diesel in my car froze at 18 degrees below zero, because we are in the Alps. And even in Milan, the winter climate is harsh. But otherwise, well, the food, nothing to complain about. Adapting, people are usually lovely. Very easy.

And then England, which is the country where I had a big advantage: I did my pre-university studies in the United States. So I had an excellent command of English and, in fact, I was the person they used to talk to Italian colleagues who couldn’t translate for them. And I would say, “Look, explain this to them,” which… I think I integrated much better than them thanks to the language, because it was a language I knew well. And I can say that I spoke more fluently in English than in Italian. I mean, I learned Italian without going to class. You learn it because it’s very similar and I really like reading. And before I went to Italy, many years earlier, I read the Olympic Committee magazine, Scuola dello Sport, the CONI magazine, and I was familiar with the language, but I wasn’t fluent and little by little I learned it. But I made a lot of mistakes. I spoke Italian-Spanish, I made everything up. They laughed their heads off and said yes to everything.

In English, on the other hand, I didn’t make any mistakes. Perhaps I have a better command of the accent, but I learned it well and didn’t make many grammatical mistakes. So, English culture, the only thing I can still point out is that they will always feel a little… I don’t know if I can say the word “superior.” But they look at those of us who come from the south… Like, well, these southern people who come here, but it’s the same thing I’ve seen everywhere in the world. When they get to know you and see that you’re a professional, that arrogance they may have, which is normal and happens in every country in the world with people from the south, as a rule, disappears.

So, I can’t complain because I’ve been treated fantastically and Chelsea is a great club, very well structured. And then, of course, living in London has been wonderful because for me it’s like the New York of Europe. Now, probably, mmm, they’ve lost a bit of their identity. And I always say the same thing, we have at least two cities in Spain, Barcelona and Madrid, which are examples of quality of life, job opportunities, and right now I think we have nothing to envy in big cities like London, Paris, etc. Because Spain’s growth in recent years has been incredible and, above all, these clubs are an absolute blast to live in.

Finally, who is Julio Tous? If you had to describe yourself, what would you say about yourself?

Well, I don’t know, I’m still trying to figure myself out. But perhaps I would say that, despite my age and the many cycles of my life, the disappointments, the bad experiences, and so on, I have always wanted to move forward, and I don’t think I’ve lost my enthusiasm. So, I believe that this is the driving force in the life of any professional or person: never lose your enthusiasm and always look ahead.

I have met many architects, and one day they explained to me why there is such longevity in the profession of architecture: it is because they usually don’t stop designing until they die. And there are many architects of the highest caliber who are still working at 95 years old, and it is because they have a project.

Having projects and the desire to do things is, for me, the spice of life, and the day you don’t have that, you’ve got a problem. So I consider myself an enthusiastic person who always wants to progress and learn. I’m a very curious person, I like many things, and I’m always hungry for knowledge.

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